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The Republic of Morrgian

Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:26 am
by xhollywood93
Hey guys, so here in morrigan we have some pretty awesome clans, and at the top Avalon, the oldest active in Morrigan.

I had an idea that could "align" some clans into an alliance or Super-Clan that would farm and level all members. So here is the idea

A new clan would be made, called The Republic or something like that.


The Benefit of Joining-------------
  • Each clan that joined the Republic alliance would get 1mil gold/items each month (maybe less maybe more)
    Allianced clans now have more power overall in the world
    Clans now have easier access to item and boss drops.
    Clans could take over Avalon as most Powerful
    Members would be leveling 24/7 as the goal is to take over and supply your original clan with gold and items
    Members would then increase their level much faster (so when you go back, your increase lv increases your clan's power rank)
The cost of Joining----------------
  • the clan must also donate members into the clan. The numbers would differ, but each clan would have to donate 1000 levels of players (or 10 lv 100's) (this number could be higher or lower again.
    Losing these members would be equal impact from all clans, so Morrigan Power Rank should stay proportionally the same for ones that join
    All drops go to The Republic to be distributed to each month to all Allianced Clans

So there it is.

Re: The Republic of Morrgian

Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 9:56 am
by Eliminater
Good luck!

Re: The Republic of Morrgian

Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:06 pm
by KiyKiy
Couldn't pass up looking at this. I'm no psychic, but I foresee much failure in morrigan in the near future.

Re: The Republic of Morrgian

Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 1:42 pm
by Jonsa
Good luck!

Re: The Republic of Morrgian

Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 2:58 pm
by Zapper
This idea reminds me of something my wife said years ago, 'Communism was a great idea that didn't work in practice'.

This is an 'ideal' rather than an 'idea'. What chief of any high level clan is going to merrily send his over 100s to a new clan which he/she has no say in running? And that presumes over 100 levels would even agree to go.

I don't see Arro, Toastie and Bd happily waving off guys like Steappa, Lew, Aeslyn etc etc to a clan that is not established and is run by who exactly?

As to contributing gold and drops to this Republic clan...that is one hell of a risk in a game notorious for just about every type of craftiness known to mankind!

Recently Sioch called me to help them at Pyrus. They had camped it for ages but by the time it spawned their chief and some others were not able to attend. We raced to put a group together, asking trusted friends to help. Sadly someone in Sioch grouped FireGavin.....he got the crest and he walked with it! Well, that was his choice and good luck to him. But no way will I ever work with players like that. Players like Austin in ZA are great (helped him get a drag disc once), but in most clans there are, and always will be, people who will do all they can to keep very needed drops.

There is no easy way to making another Avalon and as I have stated before on this forum, it will NEVER happen unless their way of running a clan is adopted. It begins of course with the chief and really to make a clan extremely powerful that chief has to be on every single day and come on during the night too. He/she needs a few 100% honest and dedicated officers (in AV this is three Guards I think....not a single Gen!). Not only is drop devision based on individual performance within that clan (in other words no cronyism), but those very powerful and thus extremely valuable boss and event boss jewellery pieces all AV clansmen have, are NEVER sold on outside the clan (other than the odd out dated Grim and it is done openly , not some AV whispering with, 'Hey dude I can sell you X if you pay well').

That alone is genius cos its stops anyone outside of AV becoming as strong as anyone inside it! The success of Avalon is because of these things and that is why it is extremely hard for another clan to come close to rivalling them. As I also stated before, hating your competition is NOT the route to beating them. Studying them and adopting their ways is far wiser. ZA was, and still is, a very strong clan but it still has leadership elements within it that 'hate' Avalon. That achieves nothing. It simply reeks of a childlike jealousy. There is a tiny element in Avalon that I don't like one bit, but it would be absurd to then hate their entire clan. The fact is, they are not Número Uno in Morrigan by luck, but rather a superb leadership system which makes them all stay!

So a huge 'Republic' clan, no doubt run by someone imagining they are Fidel Castro (fighting the 'Imperialist' Avalon) would not last, (even if it got off the ground). The ex chief of Golgatha thought he was Castro (or at least conned his clan into thinking he was on some great moral crusade to defeat 'evil' Avalon). In reality he was a greedy, ruthless and completely corrupt fantasist.

Am not knocking your youthful idealism but I just don't see how your ideal would work in practice.

Re: The Republic of Morrgian

Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 5:24 pm
by TheDarkSide
This idea reminds me of something my wife said years ago, 'Communism was a great idea that didn't work in practice'.

This is an 'ideal' rather than an 'idea'. What chief of any high level clan is going to merrily send his over 100s to a new clan which he/she has no say in running? And that presumes over 100 levels would even agree to go.

I don't see Arro, Toastie and Bd happily waving off guys like Steappa, Lew, Aeslyn etc etc to a clan that is not established and is run by who exactly?

As to contributing gold and drops to this Republic clan...that is one hell of a risk in a game notorious for just about every type of craftiness known to mankind!

Recently Sioch called me to help them at Pyrus. They had camped it for ages but by the time it spawned their chief and some others were not able to attend. We raced to put a group together, asking trusted friends to help. Sadly someone in Sioch grouped FireGavin.....he got the crest and he walked with it! Well, that was his choice and good luck to him. But no way will I ever work with players like that. Players like Austin in ZA are great (helped him get a drag disc once), but in most clans there are, and always will be, people who will do all they can to keep very needed drops.

There is no easy way to making another Avalon and as I have stated before on this forum, it will NEVER happen unless their way of running a clan is adopted. It begins of course with the chief and really to make a clan extremely powerful that chief has to be on every single day and come on during the night too. He/she needs a few 100% honest and dedicated officers (in AV this is three Guards I think....not a single Gen!). Not only is drop devision based on individual performance within that clan (in other words no cronyism), but those very powerful and thus extremely valuable boss and event boss jewellery pieces all AV clansmen have, are NEVER sold on outside the clan (other than the odd out dated Grim and it is done openly , not some AV whispering with, 'Hey dude I can sell you X if you pay well').

That alone is genius cos its stops anyone outside of AV becoming as strong as anyone inside it! The success of Avalon is because of these things and that is why it is extremely hard for another clan to come close to rivalling them. As I also stated before, hating your competition is NOT the route to beating them. Studying them and adopting their ways is far wiser. ZA was, and still is, a very strong clan but it still has leadership elements within it that 'hate' Avalon. That achieves nothing. It simply reeks of a childlike jealousy. There is a tiny element in Avalon that I don't like one bit, but it would be absurd to then hate their entire clan. The fact is, they are not Número Uno in Morrigan by luck, but rather a superb leadership system which makes them all stay!

So a huge 'Republic' clan, no doubt run by someone imagining they are Fidel Castro (fighting the 'Imperialist' Avalon) would not last, (even if it got off the ground). The ex chief of Golgatha thought he was Castro (or at least conned his clan into thinking he was on some great moral crusade to defeat 'evil' Avalon). In reality he was a greedy, ruthless and completely corrupt fantasist.

Am not knocking your youthful idealism but I just don't see how your ideal would work in practice.
A clan that can rival one such as Avalon. In years of playing, in infrequent or frequent, long or short periods of time, I can tell you, as you probably already know, nothing like this has ever really succeeded. The clans that were once the best before Avalon existed either weren't good enough or fell apart to form Avalon. And that was the end of that - they have been in the general lead ever since.

It makes you think about how a clan as strong as that was formed. It's then that you can understand the principle of what exactly Zapper has said here. In order to form a clan as robust as Avalon, you need to do just that: study them, adopt their ways. Leadership and collaboration is key.

Rather than repeat everything Zapper has said, I will simply say that I agree with every word.

Communism is indeed a fantastic ideal, but the reality of it often is not anything near expectations.

I think it could work with the right leader. It would take time, and a lot of the filtering out of those bad apples that make any clan crumble and collapse (this is why a level requirement and a solid application process, as well as solid leadership that creates the right environment is absolutely vital, straight off the bat). For a start, Avalon votes their clan members in. What I don't understand is how any other clan has failed to adopt something exactly like this: no exceptions, no invitations, even if you whisper the chief or generals asking to be invited. You must apply, and you must get enough positive votes.

Re: The Republic of Morrgian

Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:24 pm
by Aeslyn
I think in general your Republic idea has positive elements in theory, but why not just apply it to your own clan?

Obviously, you will need to train extensively to bring all players up to 180 at least, although 190 is probably more realistic for effectiveness. Avalon first and foremost consists of not only a very dedicated Chief, but also a Chief who is followed by the very best of other clans and other original members who have unparalleled game and boss experience. Then lets talk about gear....One Avalon player with standard Avalon distributed gear is then also far more effective and powerful beyond what one would expect for that level/class. Furthermore, if you have ever watched Ava take a boss, it is very apparent that they work in flawless synchronization without ever seeing what commands and chat that take place within their group/clan. This is what happens when you have a dedicated group who are all on the same page and have put their clan first beyond personal feelings. That is not something that you can just create or expect from players. I guess I'm trying to say that Avalon's true greatness has nothing to do with what you see in game, it is the connection between the people within it. But the gear does make it a lot easier ;)

That is a steep mountain to climb my friend, and you are looking at a large dedication of time and effort.

Another aspect of your Republic is not only leadership, but what happens when you have a very large clan who are supposed to be turning over drops, gold, and who determines armor and gear upgrades? Also, how do you handle a situation where a Republic player has to compete against their home clan? I will tell you right now, I'd choose my clan over any group effort immediately.

I'm not saying that trying to approach the level of Avalon is impossible, but I think that you would be better to build a small strong foundation, with strong ties between players and expand from there. Level together and fight bosses together. Building a strong clan is it's own reward for a fun game experience and maybe someday you might find yourself in a similar place as Avalon.

I'm climbing that mountain right now with my friends in Triq. Rather than focusing on the summit all the time, take a look around to enjoy the scenery and have fun getting there.

Aeslyn
Triquetra

Re: The Republic of Morrgian

Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 6:54 pm
by Aileron
For a start, Avalon votes their clan members in. What I don't understand is how any other clan has failed to adopt something exactly like this: no exceptions, no invitations, even if you whisper the chief or generals asking to be invited. You must apply, and you must get enough positive votes.
The last statement is inaccurate. It's not a majority vote, our voting process is much more restrictive than that. If anyone gets enough "negative" votes, they may not even make it, no matter how much support they have from other members. How much is enough? It varies I suppose, and depends on the degree of the against vote. 3 or more negative votes are already a huge red flag for me, but some can be trivial and can be dismissed, but even 1 huge negative vote can be a deciding factor.

Joining Avalon is a commitment to help the clan and its members. If any seed of resentment exists, then it just won't work and will simply grow into something bigger and thus clan drama ensues. There have been many applicants declined simply because one or two members are adamant they won't help them at any cost. Ofttimes when this happens, I try to find resolutions to these conflict and try to mediate and see if peace can be made by understanding the cause or source of the issues. We have had quite a few members declined before that are now valuable and contributing members of the clan, all it takes is some awakening and understanding to figure out what we are really playing for.

But then there are the hopeless cases, when one would get a 0-25 or 1-20 vote, and that I don't even bother to see if it can be fixed.

Re: The Republic of Morrgian

Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 9:26 pm
by Zapper
And there was me thinking if I apply and get 100% of your clan saying! 'Not that old fool!!!', you would immediately step in and make a case for having an eccentric, middle aged English man who even now doesn't even understand all the game terminology used in CH. Now if it was real life you would find me indispensable as I make delicious coffee and my home made cheese scones, served warm with cold butter, are delicious. Of course you would need to overcome your conviction that I 'hate' Americans.

Re: The Republic of Morrgian

Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 11:31 pm
by Eliminater
And there was me thinking if I apply and get 100% of your clan saying! 'Not that old fool!!!', you would immediately step in and make a case for having an eccentric, middle aged English man who even now doesn't even understand all the game terminology used in CH. Now if it was real life you would find me indispensable as I make delicious coffee and my home made cheese scones, served warm with cold butter, are delicious. Of course you would need to overcome your conviction that I 'hate' Americans.

When did this thread become about you ?