Celtic Heroes

Thx Guys!!! Really good info!!

Good point.

if you want to go absolute pure tank, then all vit is the way to go. I was just suggesting something that would work as a primary tank that wouldn't absolutely blow when it comes time to level.

Noob Disclaimer: I am. Really.

I ran a high str, often dual wield, warrior for leveling up to and through Eyes in OW. I knew around 100 I would want to shift to a tank spec. I have tried some things based on Blaze's interesting comments and this forum, for which I am grateful. . Think my Tank is 98 right now? I really don't know how everything is interacting yet and am still exploring all that. He is meant to be a PvE group leveling and boss Tank.

He has enough Vit to have just barely under 3000hp with armor.
He has no focus at all, but has rejuv items for energy and never runs out, even casting maxed or close to maxed skill in sequence, while in combat. In fact because of the low gross energy, high rejuv rate his energy always looks full, even when continuous casting every skill he has. I know not everyone can get the amount of energy regen he has, so might need to steal from other stats.
Dex:Str::2:1
At his level this looks like 5010:350
Future points will all go to Dex for the time being.

He is wearing Diamond gear. As I shift through the Warden progression that will change and may effect the stat mix, but at the moment his diamond is better tank gear than what he has upgraded thus far.

In high 90's he can tank things 40 levels above him, including bosses with no difficulty.

His most important skills are Taunt and Bash. He does not have Warcry or all the skills yet (see noob disclaimer above). Sweeping is also right up there for crowd control. He does not seem to ever lose aggro for more than a moment, and I imagine this will only imrpove with Warcry, which I hope replaces Sweeping for CC. He is able to consistently maintain aggro even when grouped with skilled DPS many, many levels higher than he is. His abilities are still developing, but he is not hard to heal. (I like to dual box and dual level a healer-tank combo in games I play so I understand that dynamic, since it is always so critical to boss fights and end game play.).

This said, I get to group with amazing DPS, heals and really experienced players who keep the tank alive and kill mobs efficiently. A tank is so much fun in a good group, whereas I find healing fun, but a bit stressful at times.

(Thank you Serentity!... Lol... They still have to take me by the hand to Boss locations and tell me, very slowly using simple words... 'Ok, thick headed noob tank, this boss does such and such... Don't get us all killed.)

He does not solo as fast as when he was low-vit, hi-str, dps specced. His soloing in that dps build was already slowing down though and I think this build will soon be faster than the dps build as he levels. His preferred duo partner has shifted from Druid to DPS, though the druid still works great.

I have played tanks in a bunch of MMO's and he is fun, fun, fun at the moment, even in comparison to high level, epic gear Tanks in those. I have no idea how this tank PvP's since I don't have much interest in dueling and there are no real open PvP areas. I am sure I will explore this more after he is geared and post 120.

I have some things I am exploring about different weapon configurations and would love to hear others reflections on those. For instance, I think maybe the popular lux choice for dual wielding to level or if someone else is the main tank is the Ice Sword. At the moment I don't think so for this build.

Thanks again for this discussion which let me be building in a way that is so much fun to play for me.

Well, I have a mass combo of all 4! I have a bit of strength around 50 dext, 40 focus and the rest in vitality! I seem to be doing alright t(tanking) wise with this build.

Cool thx. I decieded to go 20% strength and 80% vit I am going for a heroic or golden ammy of rejuv (for energy), a mighty shield of crowns (for health), full frozen and a few rings. that is my goal and I WILL reach my goal. Wish me luck

No dex, no focus.

One point of strength for every 4 points of vitality.

That is exactly the oposite of what I have, and everyone in my world knows me for being a great tank!
I have dex and focus, but no strength.

Im a full tank, not dps, not mixed, I am a hardcore, hard to kill tank.

Was this true when you were leveling too? Or adjusted after a certain point? I'm curious as to your Soloability with no Str.

@ a low level of 31 with no lux, I need Focus/Energy. I just bought the tower shield from the Catacombs vendor, and after equipping it (replacing my forged targe) my Energy went from 37 to 29 with 10 Focus. I unfortunately threw away one of the quest rewards that give 15 Energy (in lieu of the +40 Health one). Not a problem, if I relegate 90% of the fight to auto-DPS.
.

No dex, no focus.

One point of strength for every 4 points of vitality.

That is exactly the oposite of what I have, and everyone in my world knows me for being a great tank!
I have dex and focus, but no strength.

Im a full tank, not dps, not mixed, I am a hardcore, hard to kill tank.

Was this true when you were leveling too? Or adjusted after a certain point? I'm curious as to your Soloability with no Str.

@ a low level of 31 with no lux, I need Focus/Energy. I just bought the tower shield from the Catacombs vendor, and after equipping it (replacing my forged targe) my Energy went from 37 to 29 with 10 Focus. I unfortunately threw away one of the quest rewards that give 15 Energy (in lieu of the +40 Health one). Not a problem, if I relegate 90% of the fight to auto-DPS.
.

I mainly leveled with a hybrid build leaning toward the tank side. Just recently, I leveled from 135-137 with 5 strength in 5 days without elixers. Leveling as a tank really isn't that bad. With an offhand like the golden blade of ice, my damage is 100 less than that of a dps warrior which translates to 30 less damage per hit. And that is actualy fast leveling considering my level (no matter the build).

I mainly leveled with a hybrid build leaning toward the tank side. Just recently, I leveled from 135-137 with 5 strength in 5 days without elixers. Leveling as a tank really isn't that bad. With an offhand like the golden blade of ice, my damage is 100 less than that of a dps warrior which translates to 30 less damage per hit. And that is actualy fast leveling considering my level (no matter the build).

Thanks! I'll need some translation (or as Aleph puts it, unpacking ), if someone won't mind ?

Define Hybird (short of half str half vit ?)?
How does "100 less damage" xlate to 30 less per swing (with a 3 sec weapon, that's 10DPS?)


on a more personal note: where you there last night when Rapture tried that L140 dragon? Was curious how you did if so; too many people for me to see and read all the names lol.

It might be useful to understand something about the stat dynamics. Apparently there are two main drop off points in stat investment, in terms of return for points spent. There are some threads in the Mage section and elsewhere on this.

We begin to to see diminishing returns around 180 and a 'plateau' at 350. If we consider this we can make all sorts of builds based in it.

You might work toward having 350 minimum in whatever you consider your primary stat, and understand that you are getting less return for every point after that than you would from that point in another stat. For some roles you just may have to eat the loss. Tanks and heal Druids are examples of that.

For balanced builds or hybrids you probably would not exceed that 350 in the main stat. With Focus and Vit it gets you to around 3k base health or energy.

You can either then have a strategy of emphasizing a second stat or a second and a third. If you are just focusing on two stats then you want at least 180 in that second one.

My own feeling is that in most cases you want to invest in three stats and handle the fourth to a threshold level with gear if possible. This means something like 350, 180, 90, and enough in the fourth from gear that it is not an active problem in combat. On the way to having gear and points for that you can either:
- maintain those ratios as you build
- specialize early, more or less focusing on your main stat and the threshold for the fourth stat, filling the others in at key points

I have used radically specialized builds and currently have a project for a completely balanced stat investment across three main stats as I level. It seems to working, but it is really hard to tell until around 100-105 and I am not there yet.

These kinds of strategies indicate different playstyles and are more and less effective at different parts of the game. In some way you are the most powerful in the last levels before skill max increases at 60, 90, and 120. When you hit those points you might have to rethink investment strategy. Going up to those points you can more or less max the main skills for your play style and invest in a more balanced skill set.

For instance, a specialized heal Druid may have all their heals maxed up to that point and be able to invest a little in attack or some secondary function. Let's say you have three or four skills you are more or less maxing. You hit the max increase. In order to keep those maxed you then need to take points from wherever you have been putting them and reallocate them to you 'main' skill set, potentially sacrificing some key 'secondary' skills for a few levels in the process. This is because the skills go up by 5, but you still only get 1 skill point at the time. You can respec, or you can just save points once your primary skills are maxed, or balanced in some way. In general of course you want your stat investment to match an investment in skills effected by that stat. All this varies by class and what you imagine doing with the class of course.

'Support' roles, including the tank, can specialize more effectively. For the ranger rogue role raw level is important. You can effectively tank something many, many levels above you, hold aggro and survive. Same with heals, wards, buffs, lures, debuffs, particularly the ones that effect other players. For raw dps though your level compared to the target level is a big deal. This is true for dps warriors as well.

You need to decide how much you plan to solo and how much group. If you have the ability to group level, you can get a lot more flexibility in build and specialization. If you plan to solo you will likely need more points in secondary and tertiary stats. That balance can decsrease your effectiveness as a component of a team. Because of this people seem to tend to have a leveling spec for much of the game. One effect this has it that it makes weaker groups.

on a more personal note: where you there last night when Rapture tried that L140 dragon? Was curious how you did if so; too many people for me to see and read all the names lol.

I either tanked it or wasn't there.