Celtic Heroes

Ok, please read entire post before replying. I will elaborate on my rule and cover most counter arguments.

First, we need to make a rule to even the dicing out more fairly for non-class items, especially with the current event. I do not think people with multiple alts should be allowed to throw more than one dice for a non class item. The most important reason is fairness. I do not believe because a person has more time to level an alt and an extra device should warrant them double chances for winning a drop over someone who does not have the time or devices. In essence, whether or not you have multiple toons you are still ONE PERSON and I don't think you deserve higher chances at a drop than any other PERSON. In my opinion the ethics of the previous sentence should be enough to say, yea lets change it so everyone has a fair chance, but I know I need to elaborate more. I just saw the 150 go down by 10 toons, 3 of the 10 were the same person. Guess who won the drop, you guessed it, the person with 3 toons.

Now some will say, well I spent the time leveling this toon it should be able to roll. Unless your saying that the toon is an entity of itself and your not controlling it then both toons are still being played by the same PERSON, and a PERSON with one toon deserves just as fair chances at winning the item that YOU DO (not your toon). To balance this out, however, I do believe that if you have two toons of required level at the fight, then both toons (or 3 for the overly serious) should be able to roll for their specific class regardless of whether the toon of the other class won or lost for their class item. I don't think winning an item on one toon means you can't roll the other toon for "class specific" items. But in that same fight, when it comes to the non-class item, if someone with multiple toons has not won anything then they roll ONE DICE, not one for every toon.

Its simply not fair to see the drops going to the same people over and over. Its unethical and unfair. To say otherwise is simply greed, no beating around the bush. Again tho, in this change is also allowing each toon to roll for class specific items if they are at the fight and meet the req. This is a way more fair approach to dicing boss drops. If you level your toon to the req you should be able to roll for class items regardless of whether your previous class won something on same boss, that is the luxury you have of leveling two (or more) toons. But when it comes to the non-class items at end, you are still ONE PERSON WITH ONE DICE going against other PEOPLE.

Again, non-class: ONE PERSON, ONE DICE
Class specific: all toons of said class roll regardless previous winnings of other items.

+1

Equals out chances without treating dual devicers unfairly.

+1, making 17 alts to drop steal is wrong plain and simple. this only slows the progression of the Lugh and makes the world weaker as a whole. I do not care when people say that they work so hard dual devicing or use twice the elixirs, they are still getting unfair dicing odds. They should only be able to roll once like everyone else, and then they can use the drop for whichever alt they choose, if they win of course.

-1

I have two toons, both at a sufficiently high level and I pump out more value into fights that many people. I have two toons to feed and only have a chance to get one item, idk about you but I don't use my focus based drops on my rogue or str based drops on my druid. You have one chance to get one item for one character, I have two chances to get one item for two characters. It's not like I'm hoarding drops, I hardly have any raid boss equipment that I haven't bought. This suggestion is always brought up when new items arrive in game, a year ago asking for my druids help while excluding her from dicing drops, now with these no class items wanting the full support of people's alts yet excluding them from their earned reward, and then you have the nerve to call US greedy? I'm simply just going to bring Venus to heal/buff myself from now on, no point of helping people who won't respect me. Maybe once alts stop being brought you'll see the importance of others' characters your opinions will change.

-1

If I remember correctly this has been discussed at length and even perhaps voted on in previous posts over the years.

If i remember correctly arguments centred around utility and need rather than trying to argue ethics in a video game.

To give an example: Lugh allows multiple groups at boss fights rather than exclusive clan battles.

Look at Aggragoth, technically two or three people and their high level alts in one group could probably take Aggy down nowadays, or say four "persons" and their various alts in a couple of exclusive groups. They could exclude multiple "persons". But they don't, and hence we have very large groups of people dice for drops. To me this is better than having rival clans compete. More opportunity for all is more ethically responsible than excluding many. This could easily happen with event bosses and would allow the highest level groups to then hoard and gain all of the event drops. This too is not what I would call ethically fair.

Furthermore, it could be argued that your argument is centred in greed itself as you wish to argue for more drops for yourself.

Furtherfurthermore, the fact that level high level toons are camping and gaining drops for lower level bosses could also be argued as unethical and unfair to the persons whom are only able to reasonably defeat or compete for bosses their level.

I do agree that the odds are often stacked against single-toon players. But, if one considers the argument often given to the level 50 who is excluded from groups for his level boss (why don't you level up), the same argument could be given to single toon players (level another toon up and you can double dice as well.)

I personally would be fine with a "two-toon" cap for dicing. I think to limit people to one toon will create animosity and group battles for bosses which will lead to more exclusion than inclusion, which with the concept of ethics considered . . . .

Perhaps ethics is not the best angle to debate

You considering Venus a separate entity than yourself in your argument. What I'm saying is that its still YOU. You can bring and help and if there are class drops the alt should get to roll for said drop. Just because you have an alt at a fight doesn't mean you should get 2 dice rolls for a non class drop. I assumed this would be the argument made by people with alts, which is why I addressed it in the OP. Its unfair to others, simply put, to be rolling multiple toons for non class drops. Having two chances to get one drop for two characters is the same as have two chances to get one drop for yourself as opposed to another player having one chance to get the drop for his/herself. Its not fair to other PEOPLE to separate their toons from reality and say well its two toons...its still ONE PERSON, and OTHER PEOPLE (I'm trying to be fair to people not toons here) are not having fair odds.

And disolute, this certainly is not for me to get more drops...you obviously are unaware of how bad my dice are hahah. This is simply more fair for everyone.

And saying level up is not the same as level up another character. A lot of people don't have two devices and this is not an option.

Also, people do try and kill bosses with a little people there as possible and you know that. Many try to do aggy without inviting others and bring alts so I'm not sure I agree with you there, but lugh doesn't exlude people who make it on time.

Finally, there would be animosity and arguments and mainly from multi-toon players who will say well if I can't have double rolls I won't help then. The maturity there is awesome, but more importantly my solution still offers advantages for multi toon players (being able to win two class drops from same boss if your toon wins the roll for the class drop). I think thats extremely fair. If you level your toon, the toon should be able to roll for a class drop regardless of what other toon does. BUT you should still only have one roll for non class to be fair to other PEOPLE.

Unfortunately the really serious players want the drops, have two+ toons, and control the forums/server. If it stays this way, it will stay that few people will have a lot of drops and a lot of people will have few drops.

WITH THAT SAID: the nature/ice/fire aura set should be a class IMO, but then they wouldn't be dicing for the dmg set ones so your in a pickle there. Either way, if serve says its non-class...it should be ONE PERSON, ONE DICE -- Fair for everyone. An arguement against that is simply supporting unfairness

+1 still to OP. it should be like this: you can bring alts to a fight and upon finishing that fight can choose 1 toon to dice for a single item. say you have a rogue and a druid and the boss drops a rogue ring and a druid bracelet. you would be allowed to choose 1 of your alts that satisfy the class requirement to dice once for a single item. say you choose your druid to dice for the druid bracelet. this way, no one is excluded from dicing and all have a fair and equal shot at the drops. it is a bit trickier with the non class bosses, however it should still be 1 dice per physical person. if players with their alts feel that they are wronged by bringing 2-3 toons to a battle while only receiving 1 chance to dice, then simply they can just bring 1 toon. its really that simple. the progression of the world as a whole is only slowed down by this kind of stuff. some peoples alts are better geared than others mains. kinda ridiculous if you think about it.

i just realized that i suggested the same thing as damron, but i will keep the post there anyway.

Your a little confused mysteryman. Your first few sentences is how it is already. You can't dice for class specific items with an alt not of that class already. This argument is about non-class items being diced for by multiple alts. But the last half of your paragraph is ok.

Remember this is for all bosses. It just happens that the summer boss drops have been deemed all class so the unfairness has been much more evident. My solution still offers advantages for multiple toons at aggy, mordy, and other bosses. Your still getting the chance at the class drop for all your class AND your getting and EQUAL chance at the non-class drop as everyone else.

The problem will be people saying, "well if I can't get double roll with my toon, then I won't bring my alt," which translates to "If I can't get double chances at a non-class item, why would I help for equal chances at the item" (which doesnt make sense)